Sunday, December 15, 2013

Latitude and longitude

        Biggie congrats to the Chinese Space Agency, that successfully landed Chang'e 3 and deployed the Yutu rover at 44.1143°N, 19.5149°W on the Moon. Here's a permalink to the landing site in the ACT-REACT LRO lunar map.

        Richard Hoagland was torn from his nice warm bed to comment on this event with C2C host John B. Wells last night. He went straight for the least useful aspect of it -- the numerology.

Long, not Lat, Richard dear
        For at least 15 years Hoagland has been telling us (screaming, it seems like) that the 19.5° latitude is extra special. Magic. Ritual. Hyperdimensional. In support of this, he has cited Jupiter's red spot, Olympus Mons, Neptune's dark spot and Mauna Kea. All of which are NOT at 19.5°, but that's perhaps a minor detail. Now suddenly it's the 19.5° longitude that's magic/ritual/hyperdimensional, as Hoagland proclaims that the Chinese know all about the ritual and observed it correctly. Richard Hoagland is confused, you might say. If you were less charitable you might say Hoagland is crazy.

The ETs know, y'know
        It got worse. He went sailing off into a total fantasy about how this was China's message to the extraterrestrial intelligences. Something along the lines of "Look you guys, we're the ones to talk to as representatives of Planet Earth. See how LEET we are -- the Americans are crap, basically"

        I would have collapsed laughing if I hadn't already been collapsed in bed at the next bit. He said the choice of 19.5° longitude would have sealed the deal. The ET high command would be thinking "Hmmm, these Chinese really understand. The magic 19.5, WOW!!" This would require that a) The ETs chose exactly the same point on the Moon to designate as the 0° longitude, b) They count in decimals, and c) They also divide a circle into 360 degrees.

        Richard Hoagland is very confused. My message to the Chinese: WELL DONE. To Coast-to-Coast: GET SOMEONE WHO KNOWS WHAT HE'S TALKING ABOUT, FOR GOD'S SAKE.

26 comments:

Anonymous said...

Latitude, longitude, what's the difference? John Harrison didn't know the difference either, and he didn't worry over it; Actually, that's not entirely true.
Hoaxland makes himself look more idiotic with every passing radio show. One day, just one day, he might wake up and know he's a fucking joke.
SB

Anonymous said...

You are obviously unawares that Mr. Hoagland has worked with the likes of Walter Cronkite, and has received many awards of stature and importance. Perhaps his detractors should take the time to read the many papers that he has published, and to watch the many presentations he has made available on the web, or attend one of his many speaking engagements, or his luxury liner cruise extravaganzas, before nit picking his theories and assessments.

Trekker said...

To the second Anonymous comment - I assume you're being sarcastic? I hate to think you're being serious!

expat said...

"You are obviously unawares that Mr. Hoagland has worked with the likes of Walter Cronkite,"

Yes, I'm aware of Walter Cronkite. Who else?

"... and has received many awards of stature and importance."

I only know about the Angstrom medal, which was a mistake not given by Uppsala University but by a private entity. What other awards of importance has he received?

"Perhaps his detractors should take the time to read the many papers that he has published, and to watch the many presentations he has made available on the web,..."

This blog has critiqued most of the above in some detail over the years. Here's just one example:

http://dorkmission.blogspot.com/2011/10/review-of-awake-aware-hoagland-gets-f.html

"... or attend one of his many speaking engagements, or his luxury liner cruise extravaganzas,"

Sorry, can't afford it.

"...before nit picking his theories and assessments. "

What I do here goes WAY beyond nit-picking. What I do is to FALSIFY his theories. Here's another example:

http://dorkmission.blogspot.com/2008/08/new-calculation-even-more-fatal-to.html

Please feel free to browse this blog at will. You'll find that I've falsified practically everything Hoagland has written since 2007.

Anonymous said...

Jbw said rch was...ready for it..."a scientist. "
Ha ha LOL!!!

Chris Lopes said...

Geez Louise, longitude doesn't make sense from Hoagie's own logic. The 19.5 latitude is supposed to be important because it's 1/2 of the magical 39 degrees. The 39 degrees latitude is important because that's where the points of the ever magical tetrahedron would be if it were inside a sphere. The longitude for the points is ever changing as the tetrahedron revolves around the axis of rotation of the planet. Does Hoagland even read/listen to his own bovine scat?

Chris Lopes said...

Actually it's the 19.5 degrees latitude that is where the points of the tetrahedron would be. The 39 degrees is the distance between 19.5 degrees north and 19.5 degrees south, which is supposed to be important for some reason. All of which makes his switch to longitude even more ridiculous.

Dee said...

Chris, I think that's not entirely true. All those numbers were not called ritualistic all those years if they were meant to be just part of some proposed physical effect. Otherwise why call it part of a ritual?

The way I understood it is that you have the physical model with the tetrahedron on the one hand and the message of encoding the numbers by ritual on the other hand.

This would mean landing at 19.5 latitude might be a superior ritual message but not necessarily have intended any hyper-dimensional effect as such. Unless someone "notices".

Of course this makes Hoagland's model act more like a religion than pseudo-science. Which I personally think it is: a pseudo-religion using the imagery and symbols of the scientific language.

Dee

Anonymous said...

Wait a minute, wait a minute, wait a minute! Hold the phone, skipper!... Did Hoagie just say the Chinese plonked it down at 19.5 degrees to something?! Wow - I gotta dig out my copy of his book: I remember that chapter about NASA being part of a secret ritual society, in a country founded by freemasons, whose roots go back to Egypt but I must have accidentally skipped that chapter about how China was also founded by similar ritualistic freemasons from Egypt too! That is amazing stuff, can't believe I never noticed how identical their religions and cultures are until Captain Enterprise pointed it out!!

And if you need any more proof of China being in on the same ritual practices, is it just "co-incidence" that NASA spelled backwards is ASIAN - but without the "I" or "eye" as in Horus, as in all-seeing freemason dollar bill of the unfinished 19.5 pyramid..... I rest my case!!

Chris Lopes said...

@Dee
I see what you ate saying, and the ritual part would be true except that Hoagland is claiming more than ritual here. He's saying that the Chinese are sending a message to the ET's that they are in the know and understand all this HD physics stuff, so they are the guys to talk to. Using Hoagie's own logic though, the Chinese using 19.5 longitude instead of latitude makes them look more dyslexic than knowledgeable.

Anonymous said...

"And if you need any more proof of China being in on the same ritual practices, is it just "co-incidence" that NASA spelled backwards is ASIAN - but without the "I" or "eye" as in Horus, as in all-seeing freemason dollar bill of the unfinished 19.5 pyramid..... I rest my case!!"

You're really Hoagland and I claim my $5.

SB

Dee said...

Chris Lopes: "the Chinese using 19.5 longitude instead of latitude makes them look more dyslexic than knowledgeable."

True, true. But then again originally the Chinese did write in vertical lines.... :)

D.

Mulvaney said...

It appears that the shift to longitude is part of a major tetrahedral shift that was ushered in when Elenin, disguised as a comet, ushered in new ways of thinking. That things seem contradictory only shows how much we need RCH to explain it. In the end, there may be latitude, there may be longitude, but the important similarity is the "tude." And without Richard, where would we all be?

expat said...

He's got 'tude all right.

Dee said...

One has to understand the crazy cosmos of RCH to see why this longitude does make sense to him and has some weird logic to it.

He has posted in the past some stuff about
my name sake John Dee's "God's Chosen meridian" at longitude 77° W based on the significance of Christ/Osiris his rebirth, or just precession and disaster encoded (was never sure which one).

John Dee also was involved in Hermetic gnosticism, linking back to Greek or Egyptian wisdom traditions and especially "Enochian magic" which was used to communicate with higher dimensional beings (angels). A tradition continued by at least some of the people involved with the founding of JPL.

In this context I suppose one has to read a terms like "ET" with Hoagland. Some of this is also mentioned in the pseudo-journalistic book "The Stargate Conspiracy" especially about the various channeling efforts with these "Egyptian" gods by people in Hoagland's original sphere of influences.

This might explain why for Hoagland the question of "ET" knowing about decimal or 60 base systems or special longitudes is not that strange since he implies that in some way they originated these very things on Earth. As he used to say, the ET's are... us!

So yes, Hoagland's ET's do count in decimals and pay attention to our calculated longitudes. It's at least consistent with all his other work so far. So you have to take the whole TEM universe in or none at all...

Robert M. Wright said...

I am sorry I found your blog so late. I have always found Hoagland and his theories...problematic. I have seen many of the photos he uses as evidence and I don't always see what he sees. Thank you for doing the heavy lifting and "nit picking" them apart.

expat said...

Better late than never, Robert. I sure do know what you mean about Hoagland's pictures. My faves are the "mile high glass skyscrapers" in the black of the lunar sky. Looks to me like Hoagland had an office party and a couple of women took their panties off and sat on his scanner.

Anonymous said...

I suppose there is an interesting coincidence there with the 19.5 - of all the places and coordinates it could of landed, anyone know what the reason was why that spot was picked?

expat said...

Sure -- it's a very lightly-cratered area in a very advantageous position for radio comms.

All landing site selections are a compromise between safety and scientific interest. In this case, safety is boss, exactly as it was for the first Apollo landing site.

expat said...

There's not a chance that 19.5° was specifically selected, either. From what I've read they'd have been happy with anything between 14° and 24°. Just so long as it was SMOOTH.

Chris Lopes said...

What Hoagie didn't explain is why the Chinese would have thought their message would have greater weight than anyone else's? I mean he claims that NASA has been relentlessly pursuing the same magic numbers ritual for 50 years or so. Surely the aliens would have figured out by now that the guys in Houston are the ones who figured it out first. Or is Hoagland himself hoping to become Earth's ET ambassador, as he has proven (through his writing and Power Point presentations) he understands the magic numbers thing better than anyone else on the planet? When you start taking his BS seriously, the crazy really escalates.

Strahlungs Amt said...

Looks like somebody else with an agenda is also anti-Hoagland. That link at the bottom is the usual long winded conspiracy "what if" and "who knows" windup so I'll sum it briefly.
Hoagland supports, no promotes, Obama (you know, the Great Satan 666) and the UN. Therefore Hoagland spreads lies and is a disinformation agent. All down the right side of the page are other quack/conspiracy links like "Obama has 1 month left" and "Cancer is a Fungus (send money)".
I guess Hoagie should have thought twice before crowning him Egyptian god Horus.

https://www.facebook.com/groups/300626266626311/

LEST WE ALL FORGET... OR NOT KNOW.. OR NOT-SEES!

HOAGLAND IS NOT HARMLESS!!! HE HAS CREATED & CAUSED HARM ESPECIALLY FOR ME & MINE TO TRY TO SHUT ME UP OVER THIS!! HOAGLAND IS NOT SPREADING TRUTH, BUT A CODED SCRIPT THAT MANY NOT-SEES! THINKING HE IS REALLY TELLING THE TRUTH OR LEADING THEM TO THE TRUTH ON THE SURFACE. HE IS ON HIS DARK MISSION! You may wish to brush up on this CASE AGAINST HOGLAND before you speak of things you not know anything about (if you plan on defending him & his evil actions)! HE IS WORKING HARD TRYING TO PREVENT ALL OF YOU FROM SEEING, KNOWING, LET ALONE ASKING HIM ABOUT UFO DIARIES & THE FACES OF MARS IMAGES HE IS SUPPRESSING FROM US ALL!

READ THIS 1ST PLEASE!
http://beforeitsnews.com/conspiracy-theories/2011/11/richard-hoaglands-dark-mission-coverups-lies-and-calling-for-a-new-world-order-1427830.html

expat said...

Yes, that's the Gary Leggiere story, that this blog has cautiously commented on before. Cautiously, because although Gary has a good case he spoils it, in my opinion, by harping on about the "missing face images" that were just set decoration.

Chris Lopes said...

I don't know if Gary was the first person to call Hoagie a disinformation agent, but I'm sure he won't be the last. Part of the hazard of selling BS conspiracies for a living is that occasionally it come back to bite you in the butt. Since the audience is already bent towards paranoid thinking, all it takes is a little nudge for others to begin to believe that you yourself are part of the conspiracy.

As to Gary himself, his tale is more about the character of Hoagland than anything else. His interaction with the Hoagster demonstrates Hoagie's basic dishonesty and willingness to screw over anyone he thinks he has to in order to pay the bills. It also exposes the lie that Hoagland is some kind of selfless researcher trying to find the truth. The Hoagland that Gary was dealing with is a carnival hack looking to skim the gullible out of their food money.

Anonymous said...

Olympus Mons is 19 degrees North, according to this source:

http://www.britannica.com/EBchecked/topic/428149/Olympus-Mons

expat said...

Not according to this source:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/science/space/solarsystem/solar_system_highlights/olympus_mons

Nor according to Google Mars, which uses ASU data:

http://www.google.com/mars/#lat=18.234568&lon=-133.071899&zoom=8