tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8051630750074978974.post1463066058970560037..comments2023-12-19T09:40:12.020-08:00Comments on The Emoluments of Mars: Kiss your money goodbye, suckers!expathttp://www.blogger.com/profile/10369924104634464934noreply@blogger.comBlogger71125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8051630750074978974.post-49761174800712435902012-05-30T05:04:07.041-07:002012-05-30T05:04:07.041-07:00I can not wait to read Expat's blog entry chro...I can not wait to read Expat's blog entry chronicling this latest episode in Hoagland's adventures.FlightSuithttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18424355892619234956noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8051630750074978974.post-56526689934708785902012-05-30T04:45:38.290-07:002012-05-30T04:45:38.290-07:00Hoagland outfoxed. Brilliant.Hoagland outfoxed. Brilliant.Binaryspellbookhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17267580272489277927noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8051630750074978974.post-22174164744757480152012-05-30T01:33:56.600-07:002012-05-30T01:33:56.600-07:00Dear Expat,
You have my explicit permission to po...Dear Expat,<br /><br />You have my explicit permission to post whatever material you choose, and, to use my name should you think it appropriate.<br /><br />Unlike Jon Corzine I made a bet I knew I could win. I didn't take 40-1 odds and I didn't use other people's money.<br /><br />The Hoagland data would have been examined at the Dept of Electronics and Electrical Engineering at Glasgow. My $40k was safe as Hoagland could never have allowed this.<br /><br />Kind Regards<br />Irene GardnerAnonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16578398633865756061noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8051630750074978974.post-73180022869789649342012-05-29T22:35:24.827-07:002012-05-29T22:35:24.827-07:00IF (comment == empty one-liner that worships me) T...IF (comment == empty one-liner that worships me) THEN<br /><br /> EXIT<br /><br />ELSE<br /><br /> delete comment<br /><br />END IFBiological_Unithttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01321950739186432108noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8051630750074978974.post-66737966949577155952012-05-29T16:01:13.811-07:002012-05-29T16:01:13.811-07:00FlightSuit,
Good to hear. It's fortunate fo...FlightSuit,<br /> Good to hear. It's fortunate for all that you found a skeptic who didn't play into the smug stereotype. I've certainly seen my share of those and I always thought that if I hadn't already been convinced they were right, their actions wouldn't have done the job. Being a skeptic is not a license to be an ass. I'm glad you met someone who knew that.Chris Lopeshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15603182786879935663noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8051630750074978974.post-62735538873630820592012-05-29T15:48:26.844-07:002012-05-29T15:48:26.844-07:00And I am proud of my newfound affinity for the ske...And I am proud of my newfound affinity for the skeptic community, which I used to so distrust.<br /><br />It feels like growing up.FlightSuithttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18424355892619234956noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8051630750074978974.post-60065933303364228012012-05-29T15:47:00.458-07:002012-05-29T15:47:00.458-07:00Thanks Chris, I'm not really ashamed, though. ...Thanks Chris, I'm not really ashamed, though. I view my own history as a lesson on how belief works, and how intelligent people can get sucked in by plausible, appealing pseudoscience.<br /><br />Rather than feel embarrassed, I take some pride in the fact that my interest in Hoagland played a direct role in my very recently getting involved in the skeptic community.<br /><br />You see, if it hadn't been for the efforts of one very patient skeptic I knew online, who repeatedly refrained from calling me an idiot while he calmly showed me over a period of time the problems with Hoagland's claims, I might never have gotten interested in skepticism.FlightSuithttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18424355892619234956noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8051630750074978974.post-73319532873162659172012-05-29T14:44:14.002-07:002012-05-29T14:44:14.002-07:00FlightSuit,
There is nothing to be ashamed of. H...FlightSuit,<br /> There is nothing to be ashamed of. Hoagland can be (or at least was) a very engaging speaker and his ideas are fun to think about. It would be a more interesting world if reality worked the way Hoagland says it does. Who wouldn't want there to be ancient ruins on Mars and the Moon? Who wouldn't want there to be secret technology that could give us "Star Trek in our lifetimes?" The idea that there are easy answers to today's problems is a very seductive one, and Hoagland is very good at selling that idea.<br /><br />As to Dark Mission, it's actually a fun read if you view it as the back story of an X-Files like pulp science fiction novel (that the authors never got around to writing). I enjoyed it for the alternate reality feel of the thing. I imagine Joseph Farrell's works on Nazi super science have that same quality. As real science of course, it's pure bovine scat.Chris Lopeshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15603182786879935663noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8051630750074978974.post-66180763082069453272012-05-29T14:29:39.896-07:002012-05-29T14:29:39.896-07:00If only some of his disciples could think of these...If only some of his disciples could think of these things............. but then, who needs academic approval when you can have scores of groupies telling you how amazing you are every day on bookfaceland (even if he would swap them all for official recognition in a millisecond)Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8051630750074978974.post-963145996028967142012-05-29T14:00:34.000-07:002012-05-29T14:00:34.000-07:00I'm still just shaking my head about the fact ...I'm still just shaking my head about the fact that I spent years of my life believing in this guy. Even as recently as the publication of Dark Mission. I hounded the bookstore, and got a copy on the first day it was available.<br /><br />Live and learn.FlightSuithttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18424355892619234956noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8051630750074978974.post-83784269679597163922012-05-29T13:55:01.402-07:002012-05-29T13:55:01.402-07:00Expat,
That's the thing. If Hoagland really ...Expat,<br /> That's the thing. If Hoagland really believed in his work, he'd jump at the chance (even without the money) for a team of real scientists to examine the data. The guy has spent 40 years supposedly trying to be taken seriously, yet he walks away from that chance.<br /><br />This suggests 2 things. First, he knows that what he currently has isn't enough to convince real scientists of anything. Second, he knows he doesn't have the background (and this must really kill him) to make up anything that would be even halfway plausible to experts. He had no place to go on this one.Chris Lopeshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15603182786879935663noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8051630750074978974.post-63471649280388753822012-05-29T13:17:50.141-07:002012-05-29T13:17:50.141-07:00Yes, handing your data over to "TOTAL styrang...Yes, handing your data over to "TOTAL styrangers" is known to real scientists as "peer review."expathttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10369924104634464934noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8051630750074978974.post-31403516937687198572012-05-29T13:10:39.943-07:002012-05-29T13:10:39.943-07:00Perhaps he is planning an "all of my baseline...Perhaps he is planning an "all of my baseline data from more than a decade" chapter for his new tome, The Heritage of Mars. Seeing as how Hoagland has never released a single control measurement for anything he has ever written about (Stonehenge, the Miami Circle, the NBC-funded Central America trip, etc.), there should certainly be enough proprietary data ready for "formal publication" to take up a substantial chunk of the book.<br /><br />The "TOTAL styrangers [sic]" comment seems to exemplify his paranoid perspective on the mainstream scientific community. He's given up the days of addressing the UN and attempting to get formal validation of his work. Now, only people who have already accepted his conclusions can step onto his turf. Outwardly, he purports to be perfectly happy that he hasn't achieved widespread recognition, because "they" have all been corrupted anyway, but his clinging to the jargon of the discipline ("white paper", "sources", "verification", "reproduction", etc.) betray his desire to be seen as a legitimate scientist. Somehow, I don't think legitimate scientists spend as much time peering bleary-eyed through the slats of the venetian blinds to see if there are any "TOTAL styrangers" on the lawn, though.jourgetnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8051630750074978974.post-73152820818350257202012-05-29T11:59:28.906-07:002012-05-29T11:59:28.906-07:00Expat,
Since what was posted on this blog was tak...Expat,<br /><br />Since what was posted on this blog was taken from Hoagland's public facebook page. I'd assume tacet approval from Irene.Binaryspellbookhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17267580272489277927noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8051630750074978974.post-5350294670934805322012-05-29T11:53:09.404-07:002012-05-29T11:53:09.404-07:00FlightSuit,
It's creepy, but not unexpecte...FlightSuit,<br /> It's creepy, but not unexpected. Hoagland once suggested to a reader of his FB page that he should skip a meal in order to afford Hoagland's latest video. When it comes to money, Hoagland has no shame.Chris Lopeshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15603182786879935663noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8051630750074978974.post-21517428643056025792012-05-29T11:40:13.833-07:002012-05-29T11:40:13.833-07:00Hoagland's letter to Irene is the funniest dam...Hoagland's letter to Irene is the funniest damned thing I've seen in a long time. Love those smiley faces he keeps typing.<br /><br />How creepy that he's actually trying to undermine her relationship with her partner. That's something cult leaders do.FlightSuithttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18424355892619234956noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8051630750074978974.post-24465861195634168782012-05-29T11:21:26.848-07:002012-05-29T11:21:26.848-07:00If you have to ask for "proof" you are c...If you have to ask for "proof" you are clearly a troll or you simply just don't "get it" - HOW DARE time-waster Irene ask for the data to be vetted!! She should be stoned for not taking King Richard's word for absolute fact!<br /><br />[-the "anon" not in contact with Irene]Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8051630750074978974.post-35957859565616522662012-05-29T11:10:23.908-07:002012-05-29T11:10:23.908-07:00Trekker,
That sounds like Hoagland all right. T...Trekker,<br /> That sounds like Hoagland all right. The guy is supposedly on the verge of making the scientific discovery of the century, yet he sees he doesn't want to let go of his "data". I also love the "have you ever dealt university review committees?" line. Coming from a guy who's last formal academic submission was a High School term paper, it's (pardon the pun) rich with irony.Chris Lopeshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15603182786879935663noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8051630750074978974.post-27910610177328277242012-05-29T11:05:10.785-07:002012-05-29T11:05:10.785-07:00"far ahead of its planned formal publication...."far ahead of its planned formal publication..."<br /><br />Er, I think we're talking about the 2004 Venus transit, and its baselines & controls. How much time does he want to get them published?<br /><br />This is hilarious. I'd like to "re-blog" the whole story but I think I need permission from Irene.expathttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10369924104634464934noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8051630750074978974.post-54185998321321606622012-05-29T10:49:35.659-07:002012-05-29T10:49:35.659-07:00"Totally unreasonable quantities of raw, prop..."Totally unreasonable quantities of raw, propriority (sic) data"....<br /><br />Good god, what an egotist!!Trekkernoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8051630750074978974.post-410352694777059642012-05-29T10:32:28.580-07:002012-05-29T10:32:28.580-07:00Irene,
You know that can't happen in a "...Irene,<br /><br />You know that can't happen in a "timely fashion," certainly not before the Venus Transit; have you ever dealt with "university review committees?" :)<br /><br />However, thanks for your kind offer.<br /><br />But, if you REALLY have been following our work as closely as you stated on Facebook (all the way back to my "Cronkite Days," if not my UN presentation on Cydonia in 1992, with the warm endorsement of the Secretary General of the UN himself!), to say nothing of my recent New York Times bestseller, "Dark Mission" (with Mike Bara), then you already know what we are doing and both its importance ... and its veracity. <br /> <br />If all that can't convince your partner that we're at least "worth a shot," then, sadly, no amount of additional information at this point can convince such an individual "who had to be made" to even watch my UN speech .... :) <br /><br />The fact that you are allowing your partner to dictate "who" and "what" YOU can support, in ANY amount ... raises all kinds of additional issues; others have already given large donations to further this research, based SOLELY on what's on the public record. The fact that you cannot (or, will not ...) do the same, again, in any AMOUNT -- without demanding totally unreasonable quantities of raw, propriority data to turned over to TOTAL styrangers, and far ahead of its planned formal publication -- tells me you're NOT serious.<br /><br />Again, if I'm misjudging you, or your situation, I'm sorry.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8051630750074978974.post-69888335566006344582012-05-29T08:49:42.966-07:002012-05-29T08:49:42.966-07:00Yes the back and forth on this thing would be inte...Yes the back and forth on this thing would be interesting. I'm sure it started out friendly enough, with Hoagland salivating at the thought of all that money. I'm also sure though that as the demands for actual evidence got more insistent, Hoagland became more belligerent. He may have even tried to turn Irene against her partner at one point. In the end, I guess he didn't think he could take the risk. In other words, he's admitting his stuff is nonsense.Chris Lopeshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15603182786879935663noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8051630750074978974.post-54455784787731594972012-05-29T07:17:48.697-07:002012-05-29T07:17:48.697-07:00This is excellent sport. I hope Irene makes the co...This is excellent sport. I hope Irene makes the comms. public.expathttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10369924104634464934noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8051630750074978974.post-54735372746505028572012-05-29T06:13:10.174-07:002012-05-29T06:13:10.174-07:00RCH declined the offer. That is all the informatio...RCH declined the offer. That is all the information I have at the moment.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8051630750074978974.post-88723525947043584372012-05-28T17:30:18.630-07:002012-05-28T17:30:18.630-07:00@Chris - Irene would have to be one hell of a fan ...@Chris - Irene would have to be one hell of a fan to give him $40,000 in return for..... well..... effectively telling her what she already believes. Paying for an actual research trip to Egypt is one thing, paying Dick's daily bills so he can sit care-free, in his basement, write his "papers" and preach to his flock on C2C is another. (Surely she can't be that much of a fan?!?).<br /><br />Even if 100 of the university people said his stuff was nonsense, he'd just say they "dont get it" and are "part of the system" - but I agree, it's definitely a head-turning donation that could prove very tempting to the ego to go for.<br /><br />[think im gonna have to sign up to blogger and get a real user name!]Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com